AC/DC review

[kaz]

I'd also like to comment on the first picture of the "resin gobs". Every AC/DC ever made has these marks on it's surface. This blem, or feature, depending upon how you view it, is on the surface of the mold. It will always be there.

[ezwater]

kaz, you have molds that were made by others... More than a few? And correction of flaws in molds can be difficult or impossible.

Accepting and working with such minor flaws allows boats like the AC/DC to continue to be available.

[sbroam]

My mistake - I am interested in an AC/DC, but even more interested in a *Patriot* - the smaller AC/DC and, per my last e-mail from Kaz, not vacuum bagged (he is planning top put a flange on the mold to make that available). I've been looking for AC/DC impressions thinking that they would to some extent apply to the Patriot.

[gerrit]

My mistake - I am interested in an AC/DC, but even more interested in a *Patriot* - the smaller AC/DC and, per my last e-mail from Kaz, not vacuum bagged (he is planning top put a flange on the mold to make that available). I've been looking for AC/DC impressions thinking that they would to some extent apply to the Patriot.

Have a look on John's FB-page - it looks like there's the first vacuum-bagged Patriot to pop out of it's mold soon:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/MILLBROO ... n=timeline


Edit: Scott, this is one of the coolest canoeing-pic I've ever seen: https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-vnXV ... OC_040.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Is this you?

[ezwater]

sbroam--- I sure had to wade through a lot of innovative technology to get to that shot of your bow slider setup. What did you use for the sliders?

I ordered a slider setup from Harmony for our Bluewater, and it was *really* heavy. I drilled out the aluminum sliders to bring the weight down, but it still weighed so much that, instead, I moved my stern seat forward, gaining hip room back there, and achieving pretty good trim.

I may still install the front slider, as I have 3 grandsons coming along......

[sbroam]

@gerrit - that is me, probably 20 years ago. Got lucky my first time soloing Nantahala Falls. That's my first ME.

@EZ - waded? The links didn't work? I test them, but it's google and I'm logged in, so I'm never sure... I made the slider after looking at the Dagger catalog at the bow slider that was available for that boat. Used ash left over from a gunwale job, reinforced with aluminum angle and the original seat. I don't think it is too heavy, but I never weighed the assembly. It looks a lot like the slider Esquif installs.

[ezwater]

sbroam--- I didn't mean to say it was unpleasant wading. Somewhat like my wading the length of the Chattooga Headwaters. I got to wade through many interesting boat outfitting projects, eventually getting to the slider bow seat assembly. You should be careful, though, about so much disclosure. Someone might stick one of those "stuckwet" viruses in there.

I could reduce my slider weight by a further third by replacing most of the rails with sitka spruce. But it would rot much faster than the ash. An aluminum frame might be lighter, too.

[gerrit]

Though my AC/DC does not get paddled enough by far, I would like to add, that the hull seems to be pretty hard wearing: Going down a short descent on a little stream I hit a sharp rock, which liftet the boat almost competely out of the water and pushed it sideways. The sound was horrifiing, but the result was a scratch with a maximun depth of a few 10th millimeters

@Scott: I figured out that you will soon be paddling the "solo AC/DC" aka Patriot. Looks great, and if it features the AC/DCs character in a smaller package, it must be tons of fun to paddle. I am really curious about your impressions of that boat!

Gerrit

[sbroam]

I do indeed have a Patriot now I've gotten in it only once and for only about 30 minutes using a foam pedestal. Given my schedule the next couple of weeks, it might be a spell before I get a more in depth evaluation and permanent outfitting set up. My initial impressions -

* no, the mold isn't perfect but this isn't a show room piece, its a boat to paddle. There are irregularities in the hull, but nothing that keeps the boat from gliding silently through the water
* white is not the color to hide those irregularities, mud, or smudges from straps...
* light is nice
* this might be big enough for some light tandem use (but I don't know if I want to add the weight of seats)
* I like a boat that turns when heeled over (that I don't have to fight to maneuver) over one with arrow straight tracking - this fits the bill
* it's very deep, like a whitewater boat - could conceivably be cut lower
* Kaz suggested shortening the thwarts to narrow it up a bit - at my size, I'll leave it be. I'd actually be curious to see what it does with them a hair wider...
* my lust for a Bell/Colden Flashfire has diminished considerably

I think I'm going to really like this boat for a long time

[Mikey B]

So Scott...have you gotten in any more time in the Patriot?
Review

[sbroam]

I have and I really like it, however, I need some more time (and some help) to nail down the outfitting. My main puzzle right now is where to hang a kneeling thwart or seat or yoke/seat combo. I'm going to pull the yoke out and play with sitting closer to the middle and get someone to take pictures of the trim sitting still and underway with the seat in different spots. I may be making a whole lot of a few inches of position and worrying about retaining a portage yoke in a light boat - we'll see. I also want to see how it feels with two people in it - I suspect it will get wobbly.

In the mean time, i've been paddling it with some loose foam for my knees and a loose minicell pedestal. I'd keep doing that, but it is extra stuff to tote!

As it is, this is a fast, light, smooth boat that suits my kneeling paddling style. It spins, but gurgles a little in the stern - i'm probably not leaning it enough or might be able to sit further up (it is assymetrical...) It runs nice and straight. It's narrow enough for easy cross strokes - Kaz wants to narrow it, I might widen it a hair. I think it would work for a sit and switcher. I wanted it for lake and stream work; not a flat out racer, but fast and light. It fits the bill. I'm looking forward to paddling it more.

[Mikey B]

Sounds like it will be a great boat. I've found putting the kneeling thwart about 8" from the center of the canoe is a great starting point.

[sbroam]

Yep, but the thwart is right at the center which would make that crowded (not a problem with the free standing pedestal). I'm tempted to cut a wide kneeling thwart with a carry yoke profile on the back edge. A then hang/clamp it temporarily to see how it carries and paddles. If say, 6" back of center works that will be a light solution.

[Mikey B]

A Center Thwart...well that's gotta go I'd say if you want a kneeling thwart. Shorten and move that baby forward a bit

[ohioboater]

Sounds like you've got the same issue I have with my flat/moving water solo. Installing a permanent portage yoke would make the boat dangerous at best (entrapment risk) and unusable at worst due to where the yoke would sit in relation to the saddle.

In my case, the front of the saddle is close enough to the balance point to work in a pinch, especially with my paddle velcroed in the bow to counteract the stern-heavy carry point. Only time I wished for a properly placed and shaped yoke was when I did a paddle/portage race that required me to run 3/4 mile with the boat. Could have probably put another minute or two on my competition if the boat hadn't been so hard to keep on my shoulders while running.

I've considered making a stowable strap yoke out of some seatbelt material and a 2" metal buckle but have never been motivated enough to actually do it.