Can Millbrook Rival handle 250#'s?

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nm13
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Can Millbrook Rival handle 250#'s?

Post by nm13 »

My question is whether or not the Rival has enough volume for a self support load. I'm short but weigh 200#'s and will potentially have a gear load in the 50# range (occasionally higher with water). I'll use the boat on Class 2-3 rivers for multi-day trips. I'm not a play boater but obviously need enough maneuverability for moderate whitewater with the load. Conversely I like the idea of the Rival because it only has moderate rocker which seems good for my "get down the river" paddling needs i.e. I'm not really interested in a highly rockered play boat. I currently have an older Mohawk XL 13 which is plenty big and maneuverable but it's just too wide and heavy for my current needs. I've already asked Kaz and he recommended finding one a trying it which I'll attempt but I live in southern New Mexico and boats are hard to come by.
Thanks,
Todd
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Re: Can Millbrook Rival handle 250#'s?

Post by milkman »

In my experience with self support tripping, it's generally better to have a bigger canoe that isn't maxed out by the weight of person and gear. The bigger canoe keeps all its maneuverability despite the weight, whereas a smaller canoe will tend to get sluggish and less responsive. I'm about 160 and carry more than 50 pounds of gear when tripping. I paddle a 13' Dagger Genesis and the boat doesn't feel that much different with or without the gear. My guess is you could do in it a Rival, but would probably prefer something bigger. The caveat: I've never paddled a Rival, only seen them. So I only know half of what I'm talking about here ...
nm13
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Re: Can Millbrook Rival handle 250#'s?

Post by nm13 »

Thanks for the response. My first preference would be a composite boat in the 13' range narrower and much lighter (30#'s or less) than my XL13 with similar low to moderate rocker. Unfortunately at least at this time that boat isn't made in a tough composite hull.
There are a couple of 13ish foot long hulls that have more rocker than I'd like (Millbrook Defiant and Hemlock Shaman). Also at least the Defiant seems to have lower volume ends.
So as a compromise I started looking at the higher volume ended Rival even though it is shorter than my initial specs in hopes volume in the buoyant ends might offset the shorter length. It is very light and about the right width. But if it's going to be sluggish with a camping load it may not work for me.
ezwater
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Re: Can Millbrook Rival handle 250#'s?

Post by ezwater »

You could go up to 15' and get a Millbrook ME. I've done overnights on the San Juan and the Dolores (Slickrock) with a similar Mad River Synergy, and even with water, the boat's maneuverability was only mildly compromised.

Allow for the possibility of repairs and put together a kit for them. Practice repair if in doubt. I have a Millbrook Big Boy, discontinued big brother of the Defiant, and I have broken it to the point of leaking, even paddling empty. You have to take a more conservative approach, even with premium composites, compared to what you might do with Royalex.

Although sometimes I think the damage to Royalex is almost as great, but hidden by that vinyl skin. :roll:

Here is a link to a blog of my two overnight run of Dolores' Slickrock Canyon. You can see the Synergy, loaded, in one of the early shots.

http://tinyurl.com/ke9pwbt" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Mikey B
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Re: Can Millbrook Rival handle 250#'s?

Post by Mikey B »

The Shaman paddles fairly similar to the rival and is wuite fast as well. If you truly are only packing 50lbs gear I think both would be fine
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Re: Can Millbrook Rival handle 250#'s?

Post by Paddle Power »

i've done an early spring cold temperatures 3 nights on class II/III river in a Rival and I found it surprisingly fast. I think even with the extra gear weight it's a much better ride than the XL you mentioned.

I also know someone close to your weight who have done several similar trips in his Rival without issue.

You also mentioned the Hemlock Shaman, which again I think would be a fine choice.

Assume you are looking for a used boat, the Rival should be easier to fine than the Hemlock Shaman.

With self-supported trips I usually run with my attitude on looking for the safer route so a composite boat hull might work well, and lower the boat weight--be speeder.

Currently I have a Esquif Vertige for self supported ww trips. Heavier than a Rival but super easy to pack as there is more than enough room and easy to paddle as I don't have to be on and watch edges compared to doing self supported ww trips in my Viper 12.
Brian
http://www.JohnstonPursuits.ca" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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