C-Forum

My father taught me to canoe 30 years ago, in the rambling scrapey creeks and rivers of east TN in a 16ft "Lincoln" canoe. It was one of the first production roylex boats and the salesman won his business by offering him a square of roylex and a hatchet, telling him to see if he could damage the material. He couldn't, he bought the canoe, and he drug it through a multitude of tiny grad-school apartments and across several states. To this day the boat gets used and hangs beneath my deck.

I am considering getting my dad a solo canoe for retirement, now that he has the time to go and explore creeks and rivers again. In my mind's eye, I think it would be neat if he paddled the Nanty, and a variety of class ii/iii rivers across the east coast but I know that more realistically, he would float and scrape down the creeks of the watershed in and around where he will be living in retirement, in south central PA.

So the question at hand: what is the best boat for him?

He is in good health, but in his youthful 70's and has worked too hard to keep in top shape. I would like a boat stable/responsive enough he will enjoy it and paddle often, and that tracks well enough it won't be irritating in moving water. I could see him enjoying intermediate whitewater if he finds a local paddle club. I think the WEIGHT of the boat is a concern, because he is too stubborn to ask someone to help him put it on the car. He has not paddled much in the last 20 years, but is about to have a lot more time on his hands (!)

I am tempted by one of Kaz's beautiful designs because the responsiveness and craftsmanship will inspire him to take it out on the water. The light weight will protect him when he manhandles it at the put in and take out. I imagine that the "sturdy layup" will withstand some low water scraping (and he'll enjoy fixing it.) I also could imagine that a lightweight, wood-gunwaled Roylex boat may put up with this scraping with more aplomb, and he may be more willing to scrape it down the rivers that appeal to him or take it on the LY, etc.

Is the Shacho a good choice, or not stable enough, (and I just secretly want one for myself?)
other possibilities: Vertige, other Kaz design, Outrage, ...

what do yall think?

Sacho would fit the bill. I love my L'edge and the Blacks, but loading them will be hard on him.

+1 for the shacho. There's also an active canoe club near him. CCGH.

For me, Probe 12 Royalite hands down. I'm just picturing my own octagenarian Dad and what might suit him. It's light, friendly, has soft edges, plenty of flare- dry, stable, easy to paddle, economical, durable. I have one that is now 17 years old. I trusted it enough to stick my 2 year old in front of me to give him his earliest moving water experiences. I love that boat- perfect for an old retrobate!

Ian

How about a Millbrook Rival?

I'd vote a Millbrook as well, and call Kaz and discuss what may suit your dad and his style / type of paddling the best.

If weight were not an option there are lots of great choices...

I'm retired, over 70, and over 215#. The newest Millbrooks are too small for me, even the Rival.

So we need your dad's personal statistics.

He'll get out paddling more if his boat is low in draft, so it can deal with shallows. That might mean less rocker and a flattish bottom. I would recommend looking at the Millbrook Souhegan as a dark horse possibility, if your dad is tall enough for the slightly higher beam.

I paddle everything from Louisiana bayous to the Fife Brook Kennebec run in a 15' MR Synergy, very similar to the Mad River ME. I would find a very short, high rocker ww open boat too limiting at the easy end of what I do. If your dad is average size, I would look for something in the 13 to 14 foot range, with enough hull in the water to coast a bit on the flats.

How about a composite Shaman from Hemlock Canoes? I have a royalite Shaman. It is fast and forgiving. A lighter composite version would be great.

I paddled around in Ed Powers Shacho a bit. I will have one in the future. But I don't know if I would want it as a boat for my 70 something Dad that hasn't paddled in 20 years.

I have a Shacho that I just got and put very litle time in, but I have to say, that is a really stable boat, super forgiving, light weight even with the heavy lay up, mine come up at 35lbs fully outfitted. The boat is really fast and surf really well. I'm 6'2" and 230lbs, it float me well to!!

Just my 2cents

Based on my read of the original post, I might go different direction. If he's only paddled traditional canoes, I wouldn't immediately put him in something that's going to demand a lot of edge control and cab-forward strokes. There are traditional boats that handle Class III pretty well.

Maybe put him in something like a 14' Bell Yellowstone Solo in the BlackGold layup, and see where he goes with it.http://www.bellcanoe.com/products/defau ... &catid=194 If he gravitates towards heavier whitewater, then you can convince him to get the Millbrook for himself and poach it from time to time.

If the Prodigy X on the "For Sale" forum is still available, that might be a great solution. The Prodigies are pretty light, so I would expect the X to be relatively light as well.

+1 to what EZ and Walsh said. I'd err on the lightweight / tamer design end of things. I got to try a Bell Flashfire in "black gold" years ago - what a beautiful, pleasant boat (they don't list that model now, though). I could see a Souhegan or AC/DC in my future, too...

sbroam wrote:+1 to what EZ and Walsh said. I'd err on the lightweight / tamer design end of things. I got to try a Bell Flashfire in "black gold" years ago - what a beautiful, pleasant boat (they don't list that model now, though). I could see a Souhegan or AC/DC in my future, too...

Scott, Bell is in limbo right now. I called them yesterday when I noticed that they still have the Prodigy line on their website (but they still have the Ocoee up there, too and I'm pretty sure they sold the Ocoee mold to Evergreen).

Turns out they are in bankruptcy or something. Not producing boats right now, and trying to sell off their inventory. I got the last finished Prodigy X. Unfortunately it is red. Unfortunately it does not have wood gunwales. Unfortunately it is not outfitted. But the price was right: I paid $800 by credit card over the phone and I will pick it up on my way back from my Rocky Mountains trip this summer (La Crosse, WI, is just five miles off I-90, detouring to which adds only an hour to the 33-hour drive from Winston-Salem to Jackson, WY).

I broke my current Prodigy X on Big Laurel Creek last weekend and I want it to sit inside for several weeks to dry off, before I patch it, so I just bought the one that is advertised here in C-Boats.net. I'm driving to Alabama tomorrow to pick it up (adding about $200 to the cost <groan>). But this used boat will be ready to take to the Rockies. Suddenly I'm drowning in Prodigy Xs!

Oki- I thought of suggesting the Prodigy X, but knew he'd have to find a used example. Do you think the Wenonah Recon might be similar, that is, fast for a ww boat, moderate rocker, low draft, good handling for its length?

ezwater wrote:Oki- I thought of suggesting the Prodigy X, but knew he'd have to find a used example. Do you think the Wenonah Recon might be similar, that is, fast for a ww boat, moderate rocker, low draft, good handling for its length?

Dunno, EZ; I've never paddled one, and I'd never endorse something I've never paddled.

But jeez, do I like the Progigy X! I am down to 170#, so the standard Prodigy would probably be fine for me, but that X is so freakin' fast...

Over a period of about 10 years I owned three Rivals and four Ocoees -- Rivals for big water, Ocoees for technical water, more or less -- and I've gotta pile the kudos upon Bob Foote for designing the Rival and the Prodigy.