What about putting lotsa minicell in the boat?

ChrisKelly · Post by **ChrisKelly** » Mon Mar 20, 2006 5:08 pm

Over the years I have heard people advocate putting extra foam in the boat, like sheets on the inside of the hull, etc. Their theory seems to be that if one does so you will keep more water out of the boat.

I do not get this. It seems to me that if I put more foam in the boat I only displace the last bit of water in a boat filled to the gunwales. After a roll I rarely have even half a boat of water. I don't see how more foam will decrease the amount of water. How is this extra foam any help? What am I missing? Chris Kelly

Craig Smerda · Post by **Craig Smerda** » Mon Mar 20, 2006 5:40 pm

Chris... Imagine these two scenarios.

Big River... hard to get to shore. Extra displacement (foam) will keep you floating higher and more in control.

Tight creek/canyon.... no shore! see above.

You don't have to add anything but there are scenarios where it definately helps. OC-Playboating is a must in my opinion... get in a big hole or wave in a traditional set-up full of water.... hard to control the boat... sometimes locks you into a certain part of the feature when you are full... I would rather be able to move around when the going gets rough.

fez · Post by **fez** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 8:39 am

I think he meant that there would be the same amount of water in the boat - standing there only on a higher level.

Post by **sbroam** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 12:08 pm

fez wrote:I think he meant that there would be the same amount of water in the boat - standing there only on a higher level.

I see that as a problem - if there is going to be an extra ton in my boat, I want it as low as possible. With airbags, regardless how tightly you lash them in and how tightly you have them inflated, water gets under the bags, pushing them up. When you glue foam (which isn't going to move) in the boat, does it make sense to locate it higher in the boat? So the boat floats higher when inverted and allows any remaining water to sit lower?

Post by **adamin** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 12:38 pm

I think the foam is making sense when it can minimize the area (seen from the top) where water gets into the boat. Less area between hips/bulkhead/sides for water coming in - less water in the boat.

[img]http://www.singletrailz.de/Bilder/Padde ... itting.jpg[/img]

Fez

Dale@half-shaft · Post by **Dale@half-shaft** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 12:40 pm

More foam means less water in the boat. The difference is dramatic.

If you get serious about foaming out an open boat, you can reduce the amount of water to the point to where, even though it is up to the gunnels, it's still only a few gallons vs the usual 20 gallons.

Less water means it's going to be easier to paddle and maneuver.

Try it. You'll like it.

Post by **sbroam** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 1:09 pm

Remember that boat Edwin Datchefsky (sp?) made from a block of foam? That might be easier!

creek1r · Post by **creek1r** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 11:12 pm

Foam on the sides reduces and concentrates the mass of the water more to the center of the boat - ergo more stable, less squirley with a load of H2O.

johnd · Post by **johnd** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 4:40 am

I was thinking of putting foam in my Viper 12 and even bought a sheet of it. I'm just wondering if it makes the boat float higher when you are upside down trying to roll. That would be bad for rolling if you are lower relative to the boat. I put bigger airbags in once and found it very difficult to roll.

Post by **sbroam** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 12:03 pm

It would be very difficult (and expensive!) to foam out a Viper 12 as much as these folks have their rotomolded canoes. Mohaw used to market/describe "rollaids", a strip of foam 1" x 6" x 36" that you would glue (or peel and stick?) just under the gunwale line. The idea is that as you are rolling the boat floats higher when on its side and there is buoyancy at the gunwale that is rising (aiding your roll).

In my first ME, the boat had such rocker and I had such big air bags (inflated to stick up above the gunwales) that when I was inverted, the boat formed a "bridge". I could get air, see out, and speak to others! I don't remember that being a problem. However some boat get hung up on their sides when going over which is inconvenient on your off side. I never had that happen in my Viper, but I wonder if that is what happened to you?

All that to say, some foam may help you but you may not need to "foam it out" to see some benefit.

cheajack · Post by **cheajack** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:37 pm

I have two Ocoees. One is foamed out 3" per side and the other is not foamed at all. The foamed out boat is easier to roll and MUCH easier to paddle full of water.

Craig Smerda · Post by **Craig Smerda** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:12 pm

Just a few more facts. Obviously the goal in open boating is to not get unecessary water on board... but it does happen right? You can paddle a 30lb boat or a 50lb boat but when you start dumping h20 in the boat the characteristics of it's handling and control become altered radically. It changes how deep your edges are riding often dramatically.

Here's something worthy of review http://cboats.net/cforum/viewtopic.php? ... ght=weight

Here's the extra "baggage" you are carrying when your boat starts to fill up. The more h20 in the boat the more you are trying to push around. I'll take the lesser amount please.

Weight of Water

.....................Pounds Kilograms
Cubic cm.......0.0022 0.0010
Liter..............2.2047 1.0000
Cubic inch.....0.0361 0.0164
Gallon...........8.3454 3.7854
Cubic foot.....62.4280 28.3169

C-Forum

What about putting lotsa minicell in the boat?

What about putting lotsa minicell in the boat?

amount

Re: amount

Minimization of area (for Fez)